The C Score (2.0)

IG’s birthday present to me: a retrospective on SJ at the Olympics

Posted on: November 24, 2008

It’s no secret, in the Nastia/Shawn rivalry, Shawn Johnson wins for me every time. International Gymnast has a nice retrospective of all of the team competitions at the Olympics here.

Her toes are always pointed.

Some of my favorites:

15 Responses to "IG’s birthday present to me: a retrospective on SJ at the Olympics"

I agree. Shawn is a better gymanst than nastia, but I think what make her great is her showmanship. Without even trying, she captivates you and pulls you into the routine. Something I think nastia needs to work on. She very cold and robotic during her routines.


Shawn doesn’t cross or cowboy her legs either.
I prefer Shawn too 😉

I prefer Shawn as well. Especially after Nastia said something to Chellsie after 05 World’s AA when she lost. She couldn’t lose graciously. I can’t even imagine what her reaction would have been if she would have lost to Shawn at the Olympics.

You know, I really enjoy your blog, it’s well-written and informative, but I have to be frank, every time you make a post like this it makes me want to stop reading it. No, not because you love Shawn, which is fine. She’s awesome. But because you often seem inexorably drawn to make snide comments about Nastia in conjunction with that Shawn love.

I can’t speak to your motivation or even whether you realize that you’re doing it, but you often just slip into these unnecessary cutting remarks about Nastia–as in this post where there’s pretty much absolutely no reason to mention Nastia at all. And if you hate her that much, fine, whatever. But I’ve also seen you make comments that seemed quite opposed to the virulent Shawn vs. Nastia brawling/vendetta that happens everywhere, so I generally assume that you wouldn’t want to encourage it.

But of course every time you make a remark like that what happens in the comments is that the peanut gallery shows up to carry on (at least one side of) that neverending and obnoxious conflict, complete with bonus years-old hand-me-down rumors and ad hominem attacks. And that makes this feel like a very unwelcoming place for people who like Nastia or, gasp shock, prefer her gymnastics. Which, hey, again, might be what you’re going for. But if you’re not…

Two cents, from me to you.

I’ll keep that in mind. Honestly, I don’t think an off-hand reference to the “debate” is particularly snide, however.

On this subject, the reason the debate is so virulent is that the two define opposite ends of what people exxpect from gymnastics. I prefer one. I also respect the other. I also don’t think it’s something people about which people should have *actual* fights. I certainly don’t intend the site to be more welcoming to any fan of gymnastics over another. Rather, I don’t see the Nastia/Shawn debate as something that should draw so much emotion out of people. I find that exceedingly weird.

I’ve come across plenty of places where the shoe is on the other foot. I go there just as often, because if it’s for information, it’s still there, and if it’s for commentary, at least it gives me something to think about!

On the other hand, if people *do* get upset by small comments like this, I suppose I should refrain. Still, I wonder why the reactions must be so strong ….

Again, thank you for your comment. I’ll keep it in mind. But I hope that what I’ve said has also made sense to you.

shawn is an athlete’s athlete.

I like them both. I think Liukin is extremely graceful. But as a former dancer, if I want ballet, I go to the ballet. (In fact, I was at the NYCB opening gala last night! It was great.) NOT that I don’t care about balletic elements in gymnastics, but I do have a preference for tumblers. I don’t want to suggest that I consider an opposite point of view illegitimate, because I don’t. It’s just personal preference.

Full-in as a DISMOUNT on FX! ‘Nuff said.

Well, it’s not so much your comment itself, in this instance, as the context (I can’t imagine someone being upset about a declaration of preference in and of itself). My issue here is basically that I was confused about why mentioning Nastia was necessary at all since she didn’t have anything to do with it and so it didn’t accomplish anything but bringing the debate up and thus encouraging it in the comments? See also: the inevitable appearance of TCO! (Not that that’s really your fault. He seems to troll every gymnastics-related anything on the internet waiting for a chance to bash Nastia and fap about Shawn.)

Anyway, I think the reason it draws so much emotion is because of exactly what you pointed out. They, in many ways, define two opposite styles of gymnastics. And people have a tendency to feel threatened by the opposite of what they like/feel like it’s trying to invalidate their preference, especially when the two things are directly pit against each other over and over. It’s not wholly rational, but it’s human.

For me, it really has nothing to do with the types of gymnastics they do. While I’m very open about the fact that I prefer Nastia, I respect them both immensely as athletes. It’s that these debates pretty much always descend into attacks and I’m just really turned off by people being nasty about teenaged girls they don’t know. (Speaking in general, not accusing you of this.)

Which is why I try to avoid both sides (i.e. people bashing Nastia OR Shawn) regardless of the information available, etc. (Though, when I mentioned that your blog was informative, I didn’t so much mean that I couldn’t get the information anywhere else, but that I specifically enjoy the way you write about it.)

Anyway, I do think that your reply made sense as well and thank you for hearing me out.

Rawle, most the time, people have a blog to EXPRESS their opinions. She has a right to bash Nastia if she wants. I do because I can’t stand how much she is held on a pedestal when she does things wrong. You have a opinion that’s great and you have just as much of a right to express that opinion.

On the other hand:
I agree with you! Nastia, while still short, should have gone into dance. She would have made a great ballet dancer. Shawn’s not perfect (her flexibility is an issue at times) either though but I totally agree with you wholeheartedly.

I respect Shawn as an athlete, as a gymnast. I repsect Nastia as a flexible ballerina. Shit, she doesn’t even have a Yurchenko double!

Rawles, I remember you voting to have my Shawn is better than Nastia thread on WWGym closed. I didn’t say anything, but I noticed…

I have absolutely no desire to “bash” Liukin. I much prefer Johnson’s style, but Liukin is obviously a stellar gymnast. Just not my preference.

Aaaanyway, I certainly did not mention it to start up this conversation, not that there’s anything wrong with the conversation per se. I don’t mind debating the NL vs SJ thing — my friends are not into gymnastics so if there’s anything I’m going to debate with them that is gymnastics-related, it’ll probably be that — as long as people don’t get emotional about it.

With that, Rawle, I see your point. I wish people could keep ad hominem attacks and senseless emotional reactions out of it, but I suppose you are right in saying that it seems at times impossible! I’ll keep that in mind.

Only a Nastia fan would go onto someone’s personal blog and berate them for sharing their opinion.

TCO – I have no idea what you’re talking about. I remember neither the thread or the poll, but I absolutely would have voted against a Let’s Bash Gymnasts I Don’t Like thread and would have no desire to keep it a secret, so acting like you caught me in something is just silly.

Katrina – As thecscore has already explained: she doesn’t have any desire to bash Nastia. It’s not her intention to become involved in or set off bashing battles, which was the impression I’d gotten from her and why I said anything at all in the first place.

Kendall – Thanks for further proving my point about ad hominem attacks being the order of the day in these discussions. See also my above explanation of why I commented. It was certainly not to “berate” anyone.

Thanks again, thecscore, for being reasonable and understanding what I was saying. I apologize if I offended you at any point and, haha, also for setting off this whole other conflict.

Rawles…I loved your tutorials. And said so. So don’t get too mad at me.

The thread was a funny poll on Shawn having better bars than Nastia. You slected the “moderators close this thread option”.

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About The C Score

First there was A score and B score, now D score and E score. Where is the C score? Right here. In the form of my random thoughts about women's artistic gymnastics.


November 2008
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